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    Thread: Golems for all!


    1. #21
      Robobot1747's Avatar
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by richardDkht View Post
      dumb stuff goes by pairs.

      I want storm spells nerfed now, those guy do 80k damage with a couple of blades and an aura.. the 1k health difference really does not justify that.




      I'll say this for the Nth time and with simple words so that everyone can understand it.

      You don't need a specific school to complete a dungeon. you need to learn to use all cards and not just the 5-10 that you WANT to use.

      Second schools and double-school gear were made for a reason, people snobbed it and devs have been dumb, DUMB, DUMB!! enough to follow instead of explaining what to do.

      I play six schools, all except storm, and never had to ask for help on anything but when I wanted to go faster.

      But my decks have up to 80 cards including TCs.
      A storm scion with 3 blades, an aura, and 150% damage boost does 25k before any resist. Even if you get a 2x crit that's still 30k shy of your made-up number.

      Also, universal gear is generally much worse than school-specific gear and tends to be more difficult to acquire as well. You also lose an amulet slot since you have to wear a mastery amulet which is worse than normal amulets as well. I don't know of any schools that are required to complete dungeons. Death is helpful because bad juju is really good though.
      "Fire can be quenched. Storms can dissipate. Myths can simply be forgotten. But Death... Death is constant. Death has existed long before you came to be and it will exist long after it takes you."

    2. #22
      JaredSpellFrost's Avatar
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by richardDkht View Post
      Second schools and double-school gear were made for a reason, people snobbed it and devs have been dumb, DUMB, DUMB!! enough to follow instead of explaining what to do.
      In all my 11+ years of playing Wiz, I've only seen one Wizard who effectively managed to juggle two schools- an Ice Wizard dabbling into Myth. It's certainly possible, though I would argue you can become much more powerful by only focusing on your primary school.

      Last edited by JaredSpellFrost; 4-9-21 at 1:42:09 PM.

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      . . . with Persistence, Victory is assured.




    3. #23
      Oxnhorse's Avatar
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      Re: Golems for all!

      The only school I never truly mastered was Myth. I tried the school one time, but deleted in before L38.

      I'm sure people like it, but getting a minion every other level was not for me.

      I have the other 6 schools completed in Karamelle, and if I were to have a 7th wizard, I might try Myth again; but like I said, it ain't me.

      Oxnhorse

    4. #24
      KieranCaster's Avatar
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by Oxnhorse View Post
      I don't mean to be cruel, but this seems like someone is trying to hard to make spells out of every school so everyone has a copy.

      If so, it actually doesn't do anyone any good because the school specific spells are meant to exclusively for whichever school was selected through the test before we participate in the game.

      Oxnhorse
      Can't agree with you more. I wish spells were removed from schools that shouldn't have them. However, with all the copying of spells from one school to the next, why not another one? And one that is a game changer in PVP. SuperNova.

      Look at Reindeer Knight. Deer Knight truly represents Death, and now Ice has a copy. Why? Why would the developers provide Ice a a version of Deer Knight when Deer Knight is clearly an iconic death spell. No one should have a version of Deer Knight. If ice is a defensive school, why give them another offensive powerful card? This is the worst example of spell sharing from one school to another and should not have happened.

      Efreet is a fire spell; now everyone has their own Efreet. Another dilution. Another path away from exclusivity.

      This game feels like it's headed to where NASCAR is. The nameplate on the car (Wizards) may be different, but the frame, sheet metal and engines (Spells) are all the same.

      I'll close with your quote, which is well said, my friend:

      "If so, it actually doesn't do anyone any good because the school specific spells are meant to exclusively for whichever school was selected through the test before we participate in the game."

    5. #25
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by JaredSpellFrost View Post
      So by that logic, every single school should receive a spell that hits and sets up a Blade too, since it'd be an "extension" of their Blade spells. Or every school should learn a spell like Red Ghost, since everyone has a damage bubble now.

      My point is that just because the 7 schools may have similar spells, does not mean that they all need to expand on such spells in the same way. And in fact, such ward utility we see with these Golems runs directly counter to several foundational principles of a few schools (Namely Storm) so why don't the Devs understand that??
      Heck, the basic themes of the schools of magic have existed since launch, so why are the Devs opting to blatantly ignore them now?

      (Reminder that Fire has higher damage than Storm now)

      As long as the odds are even, it really makes no difference. Sort of like multiplying both sides of an equation by the same thing. The equation remains equal.
      "Heck, the basic themes of the schools of magic have existed since launch, so why are the Devs opting to blatantly ignore them now?"
      News flash: The Developers have been diluting school identify since Avalon. I don't think they really knew it was happening, sort of like gaining weight.

      As for identity, here are what I think the schools identity has morphed into.

      Ice: From Defensive school to Bully school. Takes and copies what ever they want, most health, most resist, most block and outstanding damage

      Fire: From Offensive overtime school to Paper Lion. The Myth of Fire being a dominating school in PVP has been spread about the spiral for years, and believed by most. Fire's arsenal that kept them in 3rd place has been stripped because of baseless claims they are top tier and too dominating.

      Storm: From Offensive Power house/Glass Cannon to the forgotten school. The developers aren't good at math because as everyone's resist went higher and higher, they didn't realize it didn't matter how strong you made storm. You can't hit hard enough to over come massive resistance. (From Avalon on)

      Death: From weird, low damage Steal health school to - not quite sure of Death's identity today. But it's better.

      Myth: From Minion maven, and uniqueness, to heavy hitting, healing powerhouse.

      Life: From healing school to Powerhouse Padawan. Not as strong as the elemental schools, but who would have thought 8 years ago Life would have their version of meteor in the form of a rodent, and hitting with the same damage as meteor?

      Balance: From a school that conflates the other schools talents into a bland 'verse, to a gimmick school that with game changing spells that are difficult to counter.

      Just my thoughts.

    6. #26
      Oxnhorse's Avatar
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by KieranCaster View Post
      Can't agree with you more. I wish spells were removed from schools that shouldn't have them. However, with all the copying of spells from one school to the next, why not another one? And one that is a game changer in PVP. SuperNova.

      Look at Reindeer Knight. Deer Knight truly represents Death, and now Ice has a copy. Why? Why would the developers provide Ice a a version of Deer Knight when Deer Knight is clearly an iconic death spell. No one should have a version of Deer Knight. If ice is a defensive school, why give them another offensive powerful card? This is the worst example of spell sharing from one school to another and should not have happened.

      Efreet is a fire spell; now everyone has their own Efreet. Another dilution. Another path away from exclusivity.

      This game feels like it's headed to where NASCAR is. The nameplate on the car (Wizards) may be different, but the frame, sheet metal and engines (Spells) are all the same.

      I'll close with your quote, which is well said, my friend:

      "If so, it actually doesn't do anyone any good because the school specific spells are meant to exclusively for whichever school was selected through the test before we participate in the game."
      Thank you for the comments.

      A few years ago, I did notice the Efreet copies and thought that the originality was dead and that someone was trying to hard to come up with spells.

      As for Reindeer Knight (no pun intended), I think it is a cooler version of Deer Knight that merged a Christmas theme with the spell. My only complaint here, is that my Ice has 11 spellements, but no Reindeer Knight. And he has tried to get the spell several times.

      Oxnhorse

    7. #27
      JaredSpellFrost's Avatar
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      Arrow Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by KieranCaster View Post
      As long as the odds are even, it really makes no difference. Sort of like multiplying both sides of an equation by the same thing. The equation remains equal.
      Just how a universal stat cap disproportionately hurts certain schools, giving everybody the same Golem spell doesn't equalize the equation. Storm, Fire, and Life are never meant to have such powerful ward utility, and giving them such spells unlocks an unfair advantage.
      Think about it like this; Storm focuses on offense while Ice centralizes on defense. The Golem spell will count as just another defensive spell for Ice with added damage, but for Storm it's huge- imagine facing a Diviner in combat rightfully expecting a glass cannon only to be met with a glass cannon that can effectively shield itself!


      You wouldn't give every school a heal like Satyr or a spell as beefy as Storm Lord, since it would eliminate key weaknesses and school identity.

      EDIT: It's also like giving White an extra Bishop and Black another Knight in an open game and equalish of chess. Sure, the value of these pieces is the same (Thee points each), but the engines evaluation will always give the advantage to White, since Bishops are more valuable in open games.

      Last edited by JaredSpellFrost; 4-10-21 at 2:04:28 PM.

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    8. #28
        richardDkht is offline Journeyman Wizard
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by JaredSpellFrost View Post
      In all my 11+ years of playing Wiz, I've only seen one Wizard who effectively managed to juggle two schools- an Ice Wizard dabbling into Myth. It's certainly possible, though I would argue you can become much more powerful by only focusing on your primary school.

      Missing the point !

      you don't need to MASTER two schools, you need a SECONDARY school to help you out against the only one your main is weak against.
      That is how you solo dungeons, no need to overpower one school just because it can't beath 1/7th of the places out there, push them to level a secondary!!

      And people keep complaining about OP gear, but aren't danned to keep a second set for the secondary gear to adapt to situations!
      They want to blast, blast, blast, without strategy, then complain the game is broken, and devs follow blindly in that logic.

      THAT is the point !
      " I can solve any issues in the world, except those originated by human stupidity"
      ".. that leaves out A LOT.."

    9. #29
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by richardDkht View Post
      Missing the point !

      you don't need to MASTER two schools, you need a SECONDARY school to help you out against the only one your main is weak against.
      That is how you solo dungeons, no need to overpower one school just because it can't beath 1/7th of the places out there, push them to level a secondary!!

      And people keep complaining about OP gear, but aren't danned to keep a second set for the secondary gear to adapt to situations!
      They want to blast, blast, blast, without strategy, then complain the game is broken, and devs follow blindly in that logic.

      THAT is the point !
      Do you take any spells from the other schools as your secondary spells? Or do you just stick with primary school and buy treasure cards of everything else?

      Oxnhorse

    10. #30
        richardDkht is offline Journeyman Wizard
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      Re: Golems for all!

      Quote Originally Posted by Oxnhorse View Post
      Do you take any spells from the other schools as your secondary spells? Or do you just stick with primary school and buy treasure cards of everything else?

      Oxnhorse
      A secondary school by definition will be trained, because trained spells give a definite advantage over TC.

      Possibility to enchant, instant availability, better deck setup, just to mention the mains.

      Then it's a matter of having a hybrid deck build and a gear set that will be swapped with a simple ctrl+(n) before entering a battle (enemy schools are visible).

      originally some successful coupling were storm/ice; fire/death; life/balance; myth/fire; but these are just based on schools playing styles, either fitting to remove weaknesses or allowing to keep a similar gaming strategy when using the main school or a secondary.

      For example, my balance wizard took life as secondary because rather than lacking damage power it needed something in the Healing range (when availing hand did not exist) and could use the spirit damage against balance enemies using elemental shields (before chimera came out).
      It played out nicely with the universal blades, and I could add spirit too to make up for the lack of gear damage, without changing habits (balance needs time to power up its hits anyway).
      I had tried also moon school, but the fact that enchant spells or TC weren't ported in the morph deck barred its interest after lvl 50.

      Then with all the changes made up to today, most of this is outdated, everyone can heal, everyone can aoe, everyone can do pretty much everything.. Except hitting as hard as storm.

      (and yes, I have seen a 80k hit with a couple of blades and an aura, it takes conditions but it was done. And nobody else can do).
      Last edited by richardDkht; 4-10-21 at 5:50:49 PM.
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