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    1. #1
      KieranCaster's Avatar
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      PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      A lot of the changes to PvP by RatBeard should be applauded, because he has provided a more balanced, more competitive environment from my perspective.

      I’ve been watching a lot of matches lately, and feel there still needs to be more tweaking with critical and block.

      For example, schools which should be going critical more often would be fire and storm, yet they don't appear to go critical anymore than life and or ice – schools not meant to be as offensive.

      I have been watching a few max matches lately, and the ones that stand out with critical appearing out of balance were between a storm V life, balance V ice, and fire v ice. Reading RatBeard’s blog, one would think storm and fire would go critical more often; however, that has not been the case. This morning there was a life versus a storm, and the life went critical five (5) times in a row, whereas the storm only went critical 3/5 consecutive turns. Storm’s last hit - had it gone critical would have won the match; however, life gained another pip, and a shadow pip and obliterated the storm. In another match between a balance and ice, the ice wizzy went critical on almost every hit. Couple that with 76 resist, almost 11,000 hp, ice should not be going critical as often as they do. I realize I don’t know what gear they have on; however, Ratbeard’s own blog talks about how broken ice is in PVP and how insufficient the steps they've taken to fix ice will lead to further changes.

      "Our data shows that Ice has been consistently at the top of the PVP rankings for years. Ice has quite a few problems (of our making) that we’re trying to correct – some more quickly than others. Obviously, until we have a chance to overhaul Resist in a stat audit – which we feel is the single most important change to Ice – we'll likely have to take targeted shots at Ice along the way. That is the intent with these NoPvP cards – we're just looking to take a bit of the “offensive tempo” away from Ice. We realize this is insufficient to “fix” Ice; nevertheless, this is a trend you should expect to see us continue in both the short and long term, as we try to shift Ice back into a more defensive school identity." RatBeard.

      Overall the changes have been good, and I look forward to the next wave of fixes for all the schools. I give KingslIse and RatBeard a solid B for their hard work to balance PVP.

    2. #2
      Jesse Strong's Avatar
        Jesse Strong is offline Prodigious

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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Your right about other schools having crit more often than fire and storm. I havent seen a balance or life miss a crit attack, my fire is always missing like 3-4 crit every 2-3 matches. I agree with how broken ice is, they get top resist, top health, good peirce, good damage, good spells etc lol thats too op in my opinion. I have a lot of pvp matches under my belt since coming back and let me tell you that i havent been in a good pvp match(200 matches already) a lot of players abusing the resists, balance mana burning
      everytime you gain 3 pips and dealing with 1000+ damage everytime, blades stacks, traps stacks and a lot more.
      Last edited by Jesse Strong; 2-7-21 at 4:19:28 PM.

    3. #3
      KieranCaster's Avatar
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Strong View Post
      Your right about other schools having crit more often than fire and storm. I havent seen a balance or life miss a crit attack, my fire is always missing like 3-4 crit every 2-3 matches. I agree with how broken ice is, they get top resist, top health, good peirce, good damage, good spells etc lol thats too op in my opinion. I have a lot of pvp matches under my belt since coming back and let me tell you that i havent been in a good pvp match(200 matches already) a lot of players abusing the resists, balance mana burning
      everytime you gain 3 pips and dealing with 1000+ damage everytime, blades stacks, traps stacks and a lot more.
      This is going to take some time to rebalance. However, this is a great start. I would like to see Supernova and Mana Burn reviewed. There is no block to the aura destruction. and no block for losing pips. And I've been on the wrong end of a supernova that does incredible damage for 2 pips.

      Anyway, just be patient. I think they are on the right road.

      Take a look at this post I started on the spell audit. I raised the awareness about these Balance spells.

      http://www.wizard101central.com/foru...ng-Spell-Audit

      Last edited by KieranCaster; 2-7-21 at 10:45:30 PM. Reason: Spelling

    4. #4
      Robobot1747's Avatar
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by KieranCaster View Post
      This is going to take some time to rebalance. However, this is a great start. I would like to see Supernova and Mana Burn reviewed. There is no block to the aura destruction. and no block for losing pips. And I've been on the wrong end of a supernova that does incredible damage for 2 pips.

      Anyway, just be patient. I think they are on the right road.

      Take a look at this post I started on the spell audit. I raised the awareness about these Balance spells.

      http://www.wizard101central.com/foru...ng-Spell-Audit

      I think that Mana Burn is fair as it is. Supernova on the other hand is dumb and you shouldn't get 1500 free damage because their pet cast an aura.
      "Fire can be quenched. Storms can dissipate. Myths can simply be forgotten. But Death... Death is constant. Death has existed long before you came to be and it will exist long after it takes you."

    5. #5
      KieranCaster's Avatar
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by Robobot1747 View Post
      I think that Mana Burn is fair as it is. Supernova on the other hand is dumb and you shouldn't get 1500 free damage because their pet cast an aura.
      Hey Robobot - Why do you think Mana Burn is fair as it is? I would like to know your perspective.

      Thanks... KC

    6. #6
      Robobot1747's Avatar
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by KieranCaster View Post
      Hey Robobot - Why do you think Mana Burn is fair as it is? I would like to know your perspective.

      Thanks... KC
      Mana Burn is certainly good, but I don't think it's broken. It's been fine since it was fixed to only remove a power pip and a white pip imo. The issue is counterplay. Mana Burn costs more pips than it takes now and only does high damage when you have a lot of pips, so you can play around that against a Balance and avoid stacking up too many pips. Contrast supernova, which the main counterplay to is "hope your pet doesn't maycast an aura."
      "Fire can be quenched. Storms can dissipate. Myths can simply be forgotten. But Death... Death is constant. Death has existed long before you came to be and it will exist long after it takes you."

    7. #7
      Dylan Windwalker's Avatar
        Dylan Windwalker is online now Legendary Wizard

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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      I really hope 5th age will involve only wearing PvP-Only gear during battle for all schools and all levels rather than sacrificing the PvE experience for PvP (the lazy option of reducing the stats of current gear to cover for PvP and being inconsiderate of those who don't do PvP). But at the same time, I'll be a biilion dollars that Kingsisle will make a PvP-Only gear bundle so they could make quick and plentiful money off of the exclusivity of it and the fact that it will probably be better than any gear one could buy from Diego for whatever the future pvp currency is (assuming Arena Tickets go obsolete)

      PvP legit needs a 100% Reset.

      Remove Arena Tickets (considering most pvp focused players have 10k+)
      No Crowns/Bundle Gear.
      No Regular Gear.
      PvP Gear Only.
      Classic Mode for all ranked.
      Reset of all Ranks as per usual.
      No losing rank when losing (instead gaining zero rank points)

      Honestly 4th age has no hope of being saved since it's been years since it started.

      Signature created by Expelliarmus in Blue Nouveau Designs, thanks!
      Dylan Windwalker: Feel Free to stop by and ask me for any help by Visitor Messages/Private Messages! (I'll try to help whenever I'm possible)

    8. #8
        Ratbeard is offline Wizard101 US Faculty
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by KieranCaster View Post
      I’ve been watching a lot of matches lately, and feel there still needs to be more tweaking with critical and block.
      For example, schools which should be going critical more often would be fire and storm, yet they don't appear to go critical anymore than life and or ice – schools not meant to be as offensive.
      You shouldn't be looking for certain schools to critical "more often" than other schools - that's not how it's designed. Assuming you don't dump Crit entirely, your chance to crit has more to do with your level than your school. All schools should find it fairly easy to approach the "crit cap" (75% in PvP) though in practice, as the dashboard is set now, most players will see about 65-70%. (You could spike crit gear to hit 75% but it probably wouldn't be worth the sacrifice.)

      So the crit is "assumed" or at least normalized for two opponents regardless of school, reducing a bit of RNG. There's still a Block % roll to be made; having higher block will improve this and having higher crit will help reduce it. Even so, the chance to block is pretty low, by design, even with a significant advantage in Block over Crit.

      All of this to say that your post overlooks the most significant part of the new crit mechanic, which is the crit multiplier. Having higher crit increases the amount of damage that you deal with a crit. So, yes, the Life caster (assuming less crit stat) will crit "just as often" as the Fire player but his crits will do less damage.
      However: It's a known issue that, despite the system being tuned to work this way, because of gear stat imbalances, I can concede your point that Life and Ice are doing just fine in the crit game - as it stands now. There are more changes coming before 5th Age, including a gear audit. The nice thing about the crit changes is that the dashboard is built to allow Design to tune it without the need for additional code: we can change the parameters in a configuration file to respond to school changes, gear changes, or even just to fine-tune the meta from time to time.

      It goes without saying - or it should by this point - that we have separate config files for PvP and PvE so the "crit experience" can be entirely different in either mode. Changes in one need not affect the other.

    9. #9
      KieranCaster's Avatar
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by Ratbeard View Post
      You shouldn't be looking for certain schools to critical "more often" than other schools - that's not how it's designed. Assuming you don't dump Crit entirely, your chance to crit has more to do with your level than your school. All schools should find it fairly easy to approach the "crit cap" (75% in PvP) though in practice, as the dashboard is set now, most players will see about 65-70%. (You could spike crit gear to hit 75% but it probably wouldn't be worth the sacrifice.)

      So the crit is "assumed" or at least normalized for two opponents regardless of school, reducing a bit of RNG. There's still a Block % roll to be made; having higher block will improve this and having higher crit will help reduce it. Even so, the chance to block is pretty low, by design, even with a significant advantage in Block over Crit.

      All of this to say that your post overlooks the most significant part of the new crit mechanic, which is the crit multiplier. Having higher crit increases the amount of damage that you deal with a crit. So, yes, the Life caster (assuming less crit stat) will crit "just as often" as the Fire player but his crits will do less damage.
      However: It's a known issue that, despite the system being tuned to work this way, because of gear stat imbalances, I can concede your point that Life and Ice are doing just fine in the crit game - as it stands now. There are more changes coming before 5th Age, including a gear audit. The nice thing about the crit changes is that the dashboard is built to allow Design to tune it without the need for additional code: we can change the parameters in a configuration file to respond to school changes, gear changes, or even just to fine-tune the meta from time to time.

      It goes without saying - or it should by this point - that we have separate config files for PvP and PvE so the "crit experience" can be entirely different in either mode. Changes in one need not affect the other.
      First, I am honored and pleased to have a response provided by the RatBeard. THANK YOU!!! Thank you. I appreciate that you do listen and respond. And I appreciate how you are trying to make the game better for everybody. Great Job!

      Secondly, I truly appreciate the explanations provided - which generates just one (1) additional question.

      What is the difference between the Critical "Stat" and the Critical "Cap". They seem to be the same to me.

      Thank you again for taking the time to respond.

      KC


    10. #10
      KieranCaster's Avatar
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      Re: PVP changes: Interim Report Card

      Quote Originally Posted by Robobot1747 View Post
      Mana Burn is certainly good, but I don't think it's broken. It's been fine since it was fixed to only remove a power pip and a white pip imo. The issue is counterplay. Mana Burn costs more pips than it takes now and only does high damage when you have a lot of pips, so you can play around that against a Balance and avoid stacking up too many pips. Contrast supernova, which the main counterplay to is "hope your pet doesn't maycast an aura."
      Thanks Robobot. What irks me is there is no way to shield or reduce the pip loss. However, your point is well taken. Three (3) pips certainly was a good change from losing six (6) pips.

      Aura Casting is now a penalty for anyone who is matched against a balance. The damage needs to change significantly since it's coupled with a great after affect.

      Well said again Robobot, and I rest my case and will call this a tie.

      Regards,

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