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    Thread: Cheating Bosses


    1. #21
      elplatano21's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Well I do think if they added a Wiki like description INSIDE of the game, so you don't have to look outside of the game would fix a lot of the problems. But honestly, most of the cheats bosses aren't that bad and when I actually lose the match, I get the "you haven't seen my final form yet" and get more serious at the game.

      Some people recommend smarter AI and that would be good.

      Also maybe make it fun? Like most strategy games, you can plan and work together to beat the enemies, no just "blade and kill".
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    2. #22
      goldendragon18's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by Chris Spiritcaster View Post
      I have been playing since June 2010 and understand the game pretty well. The number of cheating bosses needs to be reduced or at least not have some crazy cheats. I always look up cheats on Central and I understand a lot having been part of The Assistance Specialists when they were active. I honestly get tired of the constant cheating bosses as it is not fun slogging through the later worlds. I find the constant cheating tiring.

      It is interesting that in the developer's diary, it was mentioned that they would like at all cheating bosses. They might have done so, but the only thing that changed is their health. Their damage percent, spell damage, pierce, and cheats are still in place making them still very difficult, even with a good team. I ran the Sands of Time recently with my level 121 ice who has a lot of health, resistance, and decent damage. We had a full team of four where everyone was above level 120 and we struggled with the Shadowwock and Grandfather Spider. Two of us were defeated in each battle even though their health was nerfed as nothing else changed.


      Apparently, they decided there was no need to make changes or reduce the cheats. Empyrea alone has 30+ Cheating bosses but most are minor so they are not an issue. The problem are those that have OVERBEARING cheats like Titan's Trident who has 135% outgoing. Most of the others are dealing 120% outgoing.

      Almost ALL will have hit any wizard that is late getting into the battle ring and in some cases, taking 75% of that wizards health. These Late attacks are ridiculous. Some players don't have computers that allow them to move into the battle as fast as other. I know, I used to be one that was playing on a much slower PC than what I have now BUT, I still freeze at times.

      Others that don't allow ANY type of heals making it even harder for those who Dual box or even those who solo with the use of Henchmen...But even that doesn't always work out.


      We have bosses that when you get their health down to a certain percentage, they RESTORE full health. They can use several spells that cost them 0 pips but can hit a wizard with a 14 pip spell doing 9,999 damage which is going to take out most wizards if they don't have shields up. Natural Attacks doing 9,999 damage.

      Quote Originally Posted by WarWeaver View Post
      Cheats keep fights challenging. They really emphasize the use of communication and teamwork. Without them it would be the same old "Stack Feint here, stack blade there" OHKO and move on. That get's real boring, real quick.

      The really difficult cheating bosses are mostly part of side content meant for players looking for a challenge. You can always skip those, but If you wish to attempt them, then you need to be prepared. You need to figure out what the cheats are, either through trial and error, or looking them up online. Once you know that, you can return with a winning strategy.

      The only cheating boss I haven't been able to do as part of a two wizard only team was the Devourer. I actually needed to purchase two henchman for that annoying bugger because of it's dumb "Eat Em Up" Cheat.

      The only issue I have with cheating bosses is that they are present in the main quest line at all. Bosses like Old Cob, Medulla, and the Titan's Trident(Especially this one) are too much for casual players using Team UP.


      Most of us are aware that those really hard bosses are supposed to be for "Hardcore" players but unfortunately, too many are in the main story line. It is no longer fun to quest. So many aspects of this game have changed to the point they are no longer fun to do.

      As a casual player, I usually avoid those that are for the more "Hardcore" players but, I am finding that many seem to be hidden in side quests with no warning up front of what they really are.

      Let's take this quest Instance, "Fight For Your Rights". This is a Side quest in Empyrea that requires the player to fight 3 bosses. Unless you do the research, you don't realize in the last battle of the INSTANCE you have to fight ALL 3 at the same time. One boss by itself wouldn't be an issue but all 3 at once would be very difficult since they seem to still maintain full un-nerfed HP. And even worse with all the cheats from the 3 in one battle.



      Quote Originally Posted by Spellbinder View Post
      Cheating bosses can be fun. I for one like Water works, Medulla and others.

      However, I do agree that it is getting to be too much. To many bosses require certain cards to be played at certain times.

      The cheating bosses that I enjoy all allow room to still have options. The ones I do not like are the ones with a format layout to follow or the battle becomes way harder/impossible.

      Another issue I have been having is with my adhd, and the cheating taking up so much more time that I can't keep track of rounds when needed because there is way to much going on and again, taking way to long.

      So many strategies now involve fleeing if you don't go first, a certain spell is cast, ect. Basically, if cheating rng is not on your side. Pretty sure

      Again, I like cheating bosses when they are done right. Their cheats need to be quick, but not hard to spot. The ones with like 30 cheats need to be chilled though. Logging into the wiki to read up on cheats and finding a novel written on the topic in getting more and more common.

      Maybe bosses need like a 4 cheat limit?


      Agree on all counts. Cheats are fine up to a point, but toward the end of Mirage and even worse in Empyrea, they are out of control.

      I research all bosses to see what I am up against and if you check Wiki, there are no Boss Battle Guides like in previous worlds. It seems that boss guides are either non-existent or are on another site.

      I have made a list of the cheating bosses in Empyrea since I have a grandson that playes with me. I started a new account a while back just for running with him. But since he has seen what we are up against, he isn't to excited to do them. I highly doubt he will continue to play just for that reason. He is ADD so has a hard time focusing. If he doesn't, then I will be shutting down 2 accounts if not 4. I am getting a bit tired of all the cheats in main Story line that can rattle your brain to the point you get a headache.

      Fallon WinterLeaf


    3. #23
      WarWeaver's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by MrPid View Post
      Thank you to all who support my sentiments about cheating. There are some really good posts in this thread. I hope KI reads this discussion.

      There is one point I want to emphasize. It is possible for KI to develop enemies that fight within the rules that can test any player's skills. If they don't have the know-how (because they're too busy to play their own game), assemble a panel of players, representing some of the best players from each school, and they will tell you how to design the AI to duel. Just imagine entering a fight with four fire enemies: one boss (I prefer the word "master") and three minions who fight like the boss because they have learned from him. They all start with five pips (two power and one white, just like we do); they all buff their hit cards (just like we do); then they all hit with Meteor, and some of them crit (just like we do). That would be a big hit for the opposing team, but it's all within the rules. Or, how about four storm enemies. The boss is in the last slot. The minions all cast a different stormblade on the boss; then the boss hits, one or all opponents. It would hit hard, but it is all within the rules.
      One other point, as I alluded to above, there are some really good Wizard101 players. I have had the privilege to play with some of them by using the Team Up option. It is always a good feeling to know you are on the same team with someone who is really good at the game. KI, let these players give you some tips on how to develop good fighting enemies. There is never a need to cheat.
      I wouldn't mind seeing even tougher enemies that play within the rules. There is a lot that would need to be done to make them even the least bit threatening though, smarter AI just being the start. They would have to:

      1. Let enemies always go first so they can properly react to what players did on the round before. Without this, they would always remain as the pushovers they are whenever we go first.

      2. Implement dispel shields for bosses equal to the number of players in the duel. Without this, someone on your team could just spam dispels at a boss, rendering them helpless while your other teammate(s) set up and OHKO them.

      3. Give bosses large amounts of accuracy so a member(s) of your team can't spam accuracy debuffs on them every round.

      I'm sure there is a lot more but these are the first three that come to mind.


    4. #24
      edward sky's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      In respect to this, I quit when darkmoor was released because I saw the newly needed spells being hard placed behind cheating bosses/longer than needed dungeons.

      I just didn't see it getting any better from there, and from what I can see it hasn't. I was really a casual player for the most part (I didn't even search for a pet) I just trained what I had and kept it as decoration as they originally were or used for an item card.

      I refuse to go into the whole "Play this crazy long dungeon with cheaters to get this new spell!" and then proceed to farm it for months to get the only worth-wild gear post 100? Pass.

      And the fact that it's impossible to solo some of even main story line quests now of days because of the cheating is unfortunate. It's easier with team-up now, but I almost quit in Azteca and then onward because of Belloq and the like. It's surprising I finished Khrysalis at the time.

      It's not my thing, unfortunately. But hopefully side world/content will make a comeback so I have a reason to join again, or maybe I'll give up my stubbornness and find someone to convince me to work through the cheating.

      You and your son just have to go out your own pace, and if something is the deal-breaker, so be it. Wizard101 is great, but it's not the only game especially if something casual is more the play.

      Edward sky/Life/102/
      And may the odds be ever in your favour.

    5. #25
      Dylan Windwalker's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by MrPid View Post
      Thank you to all who support my sentiments about cheating. There are some really good posts in this thread. I hope KI reads this discussion.

      There is one point I want to emphasize. It is possible for KI to develop enemies that fight within the rules that can test any player's skills. If they don't have the know-how (because they're too busy to play their own game), assemble a panel of players, representing some of the best players from each school, and they will tell you how to design the AI to duel. Just imagine entering a fight with four fire enemies: one boss (I prefer the word "master") and three minions who fight like the boss because they have learned from him. They all start with five pips (two power and one white, just like we do); they all buff their hit cards (just like we do); then they all hit with Meteor, and some of them crit (just like we do). That would be a big hit for the opposing team, but it's all within the rules. Or, how about four storm enemies. The boss is in the last slot. The minions all cast a different stormblade on the boss; then the boss hits, one or all opponents. It would hit hard, but it is all within the rules.

      One other point, as I alluded to above, there are some really good Wizard101 players. I have had the privilege to play with some of them by using the Team Up option. It is always a good feeling to know you are on the same team with someone who is really good at the game. KI, let these players give you some tips on how to develop good fighting enemies. There is never a need to cheat.
      I think having a specific panel of the best wizards in the game is an extremely good idea and you're thinking off to the right track. In fact I know people have been well aware or years that the Game Developers don't engage with the updates of the game when their updates go live (assuming they play the game on a separate server exclusively for designers, to test out whether their coding went through as they intended) and I'm pretty sure there's a huge population of players who would dream of improving their game play experience directly. However Kingsisle hasn't done this at all and had they ever wanted this to happen, they would have done this a long time ago. Not to mention, the company hardly takes criticism politely and often dismisses feedback from the player base making it even more unlikely that a panel of wizards would ever occur (if it did actually happen, there's no promises the company would even listen to them at all). However, I don't think think having a player panel for updates is sufficient in improving the game in comparison to the company changing their attitudes in the first place.

      - - - Updated - - -

      Quote Originally Posted by WarWeaver View Post
      I wouldn't mind seeing even tougher enemies that play within the rules. There is a lot that would need to be done to make them even the least bit threatening though, smarter AI just being the start. They would have to:

      1. Let enemies always go first so they can properly react to what players did on the round before. Without this, they would always remain as the pushovers they are whenever we go first.

      2. Implement dispel shields for bosses equal to the number of players in the duel. Without this, someone on your team could just spam dispels at a boss, rendering them helpless while your other teammate(s) set up and OHKO them.

      3. Give bosses large amounts of accuracy so a member(s) of your team can't spam accuracy debuffs on them every round.

      I'm sure there is a lot more but these are the first three that come to mind.
      I'm not completely sure if this would be completely fair for the bosses currently in the game but definitely these could be changes done to the bosses in the future worlds so that there is a sense of challenge progression. There needs to be a way for the new world bosses to be more difficult than the standard Empyrea bosses. These ideas could be it.

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    6. #26
      Willowdreamer's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by Dylan Windwalker View Post
      I think having a specific panel of the best wizards in the game is an extremely good idea
      Who determines the "best wizards in the game" is my problem with this sort of thinking.

      Without input from grandmothers who play with their grandkids, and folks with disabilities, and others whose sole goal is not to "beat the game" but to enjoy a couple of hours of fun with friends, the difficulty of the game -- particularly cheating bosses -- will leave casual players out in the cold. I don't mind doing puzzles, and I don't mind having to do a Team Up for a difficult dungeon, but picking up on cheat cues, counting rounds, and other cheat management techniques all require Open Chat for best results. Believe it or not, but there are still many Menu Chat players out there, trying to quest in higher level worlds.

      I think any cheat that is the penalty for joining a battle late should be eliminated. Why penalize players who teleport into a battle to help a friend, or who have to flee and return due to some other cheat they weren't prepared for? This type of punishment is the worst idea ever.

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    7. #27
      Jonathan Greenflame's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by Willowdreamer View Post
      Who determines the "best wizards in the game" is my problem with this sort of thinking.


      I think any cheat that is the penalty for joining a battle late should be eliminated. Why penalize players who teleport into a battle to help a friend, or who have to flee and return due to some other cheat they weren't prepared for? This type of punishment is the worst idea ever.

      I have to agree with you. I think of myself as the greatest wizard who ever played the game, but I doubt anyone else would think so. What panel would make that decision to "best wizard"???

      As well, I think the "late penalty" is a silly idea. There are those as you made mentioned, who have physical handicaps and can't move as quickly as others. Also there are the "over eager" that rush in and don't give others time to prepare. Thus causing the rest to receive the penalty. I don't agree with that cheat at all and think it should be abolished.

      Also, KI has virtually eliminated porting in to help a friend. All I ever see when trying to do that anymore is "Your Friend is Busy".
      They want this to be a game of group interaction but then they put the kibosh on it when we try to interact.

    8. #28
      jlegendwielder's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by Jonathan Greenflame View Post
      I have to agree with you. I think of myself as the greatest wizard who ever played the game, but I doubt anyone else would think so. What panel would make that decision to "best wizard"???

      As well, I think the "late penalty" is a silly idea. There are those as you made mentioned, who have physical handicaps and can't move as quickly as others. Also there are the "over eager" that rush in and don't give others time to prepare. Thus causing the rest to receive the penalty. I don't agree with that cheat at all and think it should be abolished.

      Also, KI has virtually eliminated porting in to help a friend. All I ever see when trying to do that anymore is "Your Friend is Busy".
      They want this to be a game of group interaction but then they put the kibosh on it when we try to interact.

      I believe that KI has increased the number of dungeons that are no port, but they still allow you to go in together on the sigils.

      In my experience the "over eager" are, like, 90% of the people who play the game. What good is it to have open chat if you don't bother to communicate, plan, organize, and make appointments?

      So I'm personally ok with no port instances. Just meet up and go in together and all is fine. Or, medicine, take it!

      BTW, I do think you are the greatest wizard who ever played the game. I just think it's kind of lofty of you to point it out...


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    9. #29
      Jonathan Greenflame's Avatar
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by jlegendwielder View Post

      I believe that KI has increased the number of dungeons that are no port, but they still allow you to go in together on the sigils.

      In my experience the "over eager" are, like, 90% of the people who play the game. What good is it to have open chat if you don't bother to communicate, plan, organize, and make appointments?

      So I'm personally ok with no port instances. Just meet up and go in together and all is fine. Or, medicine, take it!

      BTW, I do think you are the greatest wizard who ever played the game. I just think it's kind of lofty of you to point it out...
      I'll try and be more humble in future posts

    10. #30
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      Re: Cheating Bosses

      Quote Originally Posted by MrPid View Post
      Are you ever going to stop creating cheating bosses? Are you ever going to return to playing by the rules?
      Nope, best to quit now if you can't stand cheating bosses, cause KingsIsle simply cannot be bothered to make enemies that aren't stupid as a rock, it's much easier to just make a bunch of cheats to create that challenge element.

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