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    1. #21
      jlegendwielder's Avatar
        jlegendwielder is offline Initiate Wizard
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by Robobot1747 View Post
      ...like some Schrodinger's rabble. The mechanism that allows the "silent majority" to determine they are in fact a majority also interests me greatly.

      "Schrodinger's rabble"? Dude, whatever that is goes to show why we are going to triumph over you cats. We got superposition!

      And determining a majority? Please, we do it just like your side (whatever that might be) does. Old Fashioned! We count on our fingers.


      "I yam what I yam and that's all what I yam."

    2. #22
      goldendragon18's Avatar
        goldendragon18 is offline Master Wizard

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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stormbringer View Post
      Just going to correct some misconceptions that these nerfs are happening purely because of PvP, or that PvE will be irreconcilably harmed by these nerfs.

      Attachment 640804
      @Eric Stormbringer, this is not directed at you.

      Seriously???? PvP players have a vested interest and PvE players do not??????

      That just made me feel as if the subs I and many others pay for and those who by Crowns to buy areas are virtually non-existant.

      I never thought I would ever see something like that said by a Staff member.
      @Sparck, can you please explain why that kind of comment was made on any platform????? I am asking you since your are our link to KI . Yes, I did find it on Twitter as well but I had not been there in a couple of days. I know how that makes me feel but I can't speak for other players.

      Fallon WinterLeaf


    3. #23
      Kevin1234598765's Avatar
        Kevin1234598765 is offline Journeyman Wizard

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        •  Justin Dragonrunner
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        •  Storm
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        •  Lord Roxie
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by goldendragon18 View Post
      @Eric Stormbringer, this is not directed at you.

      Seriously???? PvP players have a vested interest and PvE players do not??????

      That just made me feel as if the subs I and many others pay for and those who by Crowns to buy areas are virtually non-existant.

      I never thought I would ever see something like that said by a Staff member.
      @Sparck, can you please explain why that kind of comment was made on any platform????? I am asking you since your are our link to KI . Yes, I did find it on Twitter as well but I had not been there in a couple of days. I know how that makes me feel but I can't speak for other players.
      Iím going to have to agree wholeheartedly that PvE players are just as important as PvP. As a PvE player who has very little experience with PvP, itís incredibly frustrating to hear that my opinion and my experiences matter less than that of PvP players- especially coming straight from the developers. @Sparck reading this really made me uncomfortable- just because PvE are more ďrelaxedĒ does not mean our experience matters less.

      On a similar note, if spells are nerfed, like glow bugs for example, that will truly be a huge step back in my PvE experience. On my storm wiz, bugs is one of the key reasons I was able to finish the last couple worlds. Nerfing it is going to make the storm experienxe in later worlds even harder than it originally was. Stormís low health is already a huge crutch. You have the ability to make changes solely to PvP, as weíve seen with juju, so PLEASE consider this and the experience of PvE players as you make your next decisions, as I feel the coming months are going to bring major changes.

      Edit: As an add on to this, I know very little about PvP but from what Iíve heard, isnít storm already a mid to low tier school in the arena? Why is bugs the biggest change in spells that KI is talking about if itís not even competitive in the arena?
      Last edited by Kevin1234598765; 6-26-20 at 1:05:14 PM.

      Spiral Shadows | Justin Dragonrunner | Woodland Graphics



    4. #24
        richardDkht is offline Journeyman Wizard
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by Eric Stormbringer View Post
      Just going to correct some misconceptions that these nerfs are happening purely because of PvP, or that PvE will be irreconcilably harmed by these nerfs.

      Attachment 640804

      Attachment 640805

      Attachment 640806
      Quote Originally Posted by Robobot1747 View Post
      For all the hand-wringing I've seen about things like the Lore nerf, I can't recall EVER seeing a Balance wizard cast Loremaster in PvE. Or Mana Burn. It seems like all the people who actually use it only appear whenever it's about to be nerfed and then pop out of existence like some Schrodinger's rabble. The mechanism that allows the "silent majority" to determine they are in fact a majority also interests me greatly.

      I am a balance wizard.

      I spent 8 (EIGHT) months drilling and farming and grinding to get all the required material to craft loremaster.

      Spent all my free time on that, after carefully assessing the interest of using it.

      Then i finally crafted it and added it to my deck.

      It wasn't the strongest 4-Pips hit, but it was a tactical one. Allowed me to buy time for mysel for my teammates to build up, reduced opponent damage, or was a finishing hit.

      That lasted for about 4 months. Then they nerfed it saying "it's too powerful".

      Well, had i know that they would nerf it, had they said when it came out "we'll probably reduce its values later on", or had they given ANY sign about a possible nerfing, I would have employed that unique time of my life doing something else.

      But they didn't. Some smarties just woke up a day and said "oh look, that's too much, let me change it" and off they went.

      (edit: I strongly believe that this is done for that "new content" that devs talk about in their tweets - namely stuff like introduction of spellments. So I see them very well later on create crazy hard to get or crowns pack spellments to bring back either loremaster damage or its debuffs to what they used to be. Great way to do new with old! And grab some money on the way.)

      Due to probability, which is not linear, a -25% smokescreen isn't just 10% less than a 35%. It basicly means that before enemies would fizzle once out of three time on average, and now they almost never fizzle. Don't believe my words, try it and come back with statistics.

      The -15% weakness isn't even enough to counter some armor piercing anymore.

      And the damage is ridiculously low for a 4 pips spell. The lowest of all 4-pips spells, actually, even lower than vampire with its steal health.

      There is responsibility behind this kind of decision. And everyone must understand that they don't just go say "i'll give you something very hard to do, but once you achieve it, i'll ruin it for you" without consequences.

      As a parallel, in China people can be expropriated by the government at any time.
      Result, most chinese investors don't care about anything long-term, and usually flee the country when they want to build up a business (look at Philippines to see an example on this).

      KI did just that - they took for granted that they own the cards, so hard-earning players have no rights or word to say. Well, in that case, conversation is over, and go die painfully...

      As of mana burn, I had it in my deck for a while, but using it has always been tricky since I had to wait for the right amount of pips. Understand that this spell was already weaker than most 90% of time, since it can't be enchanted (did you know that?).

      That means that for a 5 pips spell, in order to do as much damage as any equivalent other (that can be enchanted with a Big fat 300~ish card), opponent would need to have at least 9 pips and go second. And even like that, mana burn would not prevent opponent's spell to cast. For the same price, i could judge them and do way more damage, maybe even kill. The advantage was that, if they didn't use their pips that round, i'd sometimes get a "quiet" round before they hit me next, allowing to shield, blade or heal.

      So it was a really strategic spell, again.
      But I accepted it as that, since it was a balance spell, and balance power come from strategy indeed.

      Except that now, after burning 5 of my pips, and changing pretty much nothing to a powerful opponent, I am always at disadvantage. The only real advantage, the "quiet round" that would happen about 40% of times, now never comes, as they get the same amount of pips just after.

      So I ended up throwing this spell too on the useless pile. Thanks a lot KI.

      Yes, my PVE has been
      irreconcilably harmed by these nerfs
      I may be a minority; but does that give rights to somebody to hurt me?

      (EDIT: and matter of cold logic, if the spell were really OP, why were they "so little used that never seen someone cast them"? shouldn't it be the other way round?)
      Last edited by richardDkht; 6-26-20 at 2:40:06 PM.

    5. #25
      KingNothing's Avatar
        KingNothing is offline Grandmaster Wizard

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        •  Death
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      So yesterday was the first I have heard about the possible changes in the shadow spells and shadow pips. I've read and watched some interesting opinions on the subject. Some are good and make a lot of sense. Others not so much IMO. I am in agreement that generally the shadow spells are overpowered. I may be in the minority, but except for the most difficult bosses most of this game is still the same for me: a blade or two or three, maybe a trap or feint, enchant my spell, get a shadow pip, hit and move on. Usually that hit far exceeds the health of my opponent. The only thing that stops me is the occasional stun or screen or whatever. Honestly, it can be easy at times. So if we're going to bring down the spells a little to attempt to level a playing field that is already leaning heavily in my favor, I'm OK with that; and especially moving forward in the game. I can see the reasoning behind a power check.

      As far as the shadow pips go, this one is a little tougher for me. Yes, I get shadow pips but I wouldn't say they are over abundant. I cannot recall how many times it has been me or a team member who is ready to hit but utters the phrase, "Just waiting for a shadow pip". I happens a lot, so I'm not sure I am on board with this yet. What I do agree with on shadow pips is forcing us to use our brains just a little. What if a shadow pip never comes? What do you have has a good back up? I do like this part of it. Now we need to look at our deck, spells and # of pips to determine, OK so shadow pips are going to be tougher so what am I going to do.

      Long term outlook, I think it helps the game and moving forward towards 140, 150, 160 and beyond. I'm not sure I am a fan of just making new spells bigger and badder and producing new gear that can handle any situation. We already have certain factions that can resist everything and others can get their damage super, super high. 100% critical is super easy to obtain. Moving forward I can see the issue evolving. The big questions for me is will it be done correctly? The track record IMO is not so hot. Lots of missteps lately. We'll see.
      ďMaybe someday we could become friends. Friends who ride majestic, translucent steeds, shooting flaming arrows across the bridge of Hemdale.Ē

    6. #26
      Sparck's Avatar
        Sparck is offline Wizard101 US Faculty
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Can someone give me a brief response as to what I need to respond to. There's a lot of chatter here and I'm not sure what the question was all about.

      Thanks!

    7. #27
      goldendragon18's Avatar
        goldendragon18 is offline Master Wizard

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        •  Fallon WinterLeaf
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        •  Life
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by Sparck View Post
      Can someone give me a brief response as to what I need to respond to. There's a lot of chatter here and I'm not sure what the question was all about.

      Thanks!

      I asked if you could please explain why any staff member would make a comment like the one at the end of Wizard101 Dev reply stating that PvPers have a vested interest in speaking up and PvE players do not.


      This was my original Tag to you:.... @Sparck, can you please explain why that kind of comment was made on any platform????? I am asking you since your are our link to KI . Yes, I did find it on Twitter as well but I had not been there in a couple of days. I know how that makes me feel but I can't speak for other players.
      Last edited by goldendragon18; 6-26-20 at 6:03:28 PM.

      Fallon WinterLeaf


    8. #28
      medlnic15's Avatar
        medlnic15 is offline Journeyman Wizard
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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by KingNothing View Post
      I may be in the minority, but except for the most difficult bosses most of this game is still the same for me: a blade or two or three, maybe a trap or feint, enchant my spell, get a shadow pip, hit and move on. Usually that hit far exceeds the health of my opponent. The only thing that stops me is the occasional stun or screen or whatever. Honestly, it can be easy at times. So if we're going to bring down the spells a little to attempt to level a playing field that is already leaning heavily in my favor, I'm OK with that; and especially moving forward in the game. I can see the reasoning behind a power check.
      It can depend on which school you are using and how well you can build decks. Gear can also obviously be a factor, but I don't think many people that don't have decent gear will make it very far in these new worlds. Like @Kevin1234598765 I have primarily been using a Storm to go through, and it can be difficult sometimes because you have very little health. I just have the opposite opinions about the nerf because I don't think lowering the damage of Glowbug Squall will make it harder for me to kill enemies. I think of it as more that they will have a harder time killing me, instead.

      Unless if you are saying that you are soloing on a Storm and didn't have much problem, give me some tips then. Haha.

      All I would want from new gear is something similar to Darkmoor gear with more health, and closer health between schools. We don't really need much more damage or resist for a little while. It is insane to think that Ice has double the health that Storm has, with just about the same stats. Which is all really a more important PvP issue, but does also affect the PvE experience for some schools as well. I'm glad that the PvP is getting the attention it has desperately needed, and I do think in the long-term it will improve the game for the rest of us as well. If it is done right, of course.
      130 S | 125 F | 110 F | 75 L | 75 I | 75 D
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    9. #29
      Robobot1747's Avatar
        Robobot1747 is offline Journeyman Wizard

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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by goldendragon18 View Post
      I asked if you could please explain why any staff member would make a comment like the one at the end of Wizard101 Dev reply stating that PvPers have a vested interest in speaking up and PvE players do not.


      This was my original Tag to you:.... @Sparck, can you please explain why that kind of comment was made on any platform????? I am asking you since your are our link to KI . Yes, I did find it on Twitter as well but I had not been there in a couple of days. I know how that makes me feel but I can't speak for other players.
      He said it because it's true. Having an overpowered spell isn't going to ruin a PvE-er's day nearly as badly as it will warp the meta around a school(s) in PvP.
      "Fire can be quenched. Storms can dissipate. Myths can simply be forgotten. But Death... Death is constant. Death has existed long before you came to be and it will exist long after it takes you."

    10. #30
      Eric Stormbringer's Avatar
        Eric Stormbringer is offline Grandmaster Wizard

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      Re: KI Live Summer Test Realm Teaser

      Quote Originally Posted by goldendragon18 View Post
      @Eric Stormbringer, this is not directed at you.

      Seriously???? PvP players have a vested interest and PvE players do not??????

      That just made me feel as if the subs I and many others pay for and those who by Crowns to buy areas are virtually non-existant.

      I never thought I would ever see something like that said by a Staff member.
      @Sparck, can you please explain why that kind of comment was made on any platform????? I am asking you since your are our link to KI . Yes, I did find it on Twitter as well but I had not been there in a couple of days. I know how that makes me feel but I can't speak for other players.
      I believe you may have misunderstood what is being said here. They didn't say PvE players don't have a vested interest in general. Simply that PvE players have no vested interest in speaking up when a stat, item, spell etc is advantageous to the player even if it is overpowered. Meanwhile PvP players do have a vested interest in pointing out said discrepancies since those stats, items, spells etc are being actively used by/against them in PvP.

      - - - Updated - - -

      Quote Originally Posted by Kevin1234598765 View Post
      Iím going to have to agree wholeheartedly that PvE players are just as important as PvP. As a PvE player who has very little experience with PvP, itís incredibly frustrating to hear that my opinion and my experiences matter less than that of PvP players- especially coming straight from the developers. @Sparck reading this really made me uncomfortable- just because PvE are more ďrelaxedĒ does not mean our experience matters less.

      On a similar note, if spells are nerfed, like glow bugs for example, that will truly be a huge step back in my PvE experience. On my storm wiz, bugs is one of the key reasons I was able to finish the last couple worlds. Nerfing it is going to make the storm experienxe in later worlds even harder than it originally was. Stormís low health is already a huge crutch. You have the ability to make changes solely to PvP, as weíve seen with juju, so PLEASE consider this and the experience of PvE players as you make your next decisions, as I feel the coming months are going to bring major changes.

      Edit: As an add on to this, I know very little about PvP but from what Iíve heard, isnít storm already a mid to low tier school in the arena? Why is bugs the biggest change in spells that KI is talking about if itís not even competitive in the arena?
      The simple reason, as illustrated in the posts- is that game balance in general is being looked at NOT just PvP. Yes Storm is low-mid tier in PvP and bugs isn't a problem in PvP. However bugs is a massive problem in terms of PvE and spell balance, hence why it(and many of the other shadow spells) are being nerfed,

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