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  • Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
    Results 1 to 10 of 12
    1. #1
        jzents is offline Apprentice Wizard

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      Why Death as Secondary School?

      I have read several discussions of which secondary school for life. There is a general consensus that if PvE is your goal it should be Death and if PvP and you have a MA, then it should be Myth. I do not fully get the benefits of Death. None of Death's buffs are trainable (of course I do not count the Spirit Blades from Krok as a Death buff, but of course those are trainable). So you are limited to the Spirit Blades and Traps from Krok. Thus Death attacks are not buffed much, even allowing that you have a MA for Death. So are we really being told to drop 7 training points for Feint, and that is the only benefit we get from it? Or is there dual school gear in the 50+ worlds in which we can get some boost? (I have used the lower level dual school crafted gear but always dropped it because it never gives power pips, which you can get from Life specific gear.) I would really appreciate someone who is using Death as a secondary school to elaborate on the benefits of Death beyond Feint if there are any. Particularly, can they comment on what I perceive as the limitations of Feint. It is a universal buff, which also means that any attempt to get ride of a shield will set it off. And of course a wand strike to get rid of a weakness will do the same. Schools against which see that as a problem as not just one. Death rarely shields, so not a problem there. But life does and casts weakness. And then there is balance and ice, both of which tend to shield. That makes 3 schools out of 7 that can make using Feint problematical. Thank you in advance.

    2. #2
      LifewiziScarlet's Avatar
        LifewiziScarlet is offline Initiate Wizard
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      I only trained to Feint on my life wiz, and it is a HUGE help when you get to Azteca bosses with 15K+ health. And if you want to remove shields, just get some tc pierce from the bazaar.

      Signature & Avatar done by myself.

    3. #3
      Zarin64's Avatar
        Zarin64 is offline Grandmaster Wizard

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        •  Khrysalis
        •  Wizard's School:
        •  Death
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        •  Polar Cat, Red Ghost, Enchanted Armament, Pixie Queen 57 (Card)
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      Quote Originally Posted by jzents View Post
      I have read several discussions of which secondary school for life. There is a general consensus that if PvE is your goal it should be Death and if PvP and you have a MA, then it should be Myth. I do not fully get the benefits of Death. None of Death's buffs are trainable (of course I do not count the Spirit Blades from Krok as a Death buff, but of course those are trainable). So you are limited to the Spirit Blades and Traps from Krok. Thus Death attacks are not buffed much, even allowing that you have a MA for Death. So are we really being told to drop 7 training points for Feint, and that is the only benefit we get from it? Or is there dual school gear in the 50+ worlds in which we can get some boost? (I have used the lower level dual school crafted gear but always dropped it because it never gives power pips, which you can get from Life specific gear.) I would really appreciate someone who is using Death as a secondary school to elaborate on the benefits of Death beyond Feint if there are any. Particularly, can they comment on what I perceive as the limitations of Feint. It is a universal buff, which also means that any attempt to get ride of a shield will set it off. And of course a wand strike to get rid of a weakness will do the same. Schools against which see that as a problem as not just one. Death rarely shields, so not a problem there. But life does and casts weakness. And then there is balance and ice, both of which tend to shield. That makes 3 schools out of 7 that can make using Feint problematical. Thank you in advance.
      Yes, Feint is the one and only reason to train Death, so not everyone needs it (though Life, Ice and probably Balance do). However, Feint considerably speeds boss fights, and, once you get deep enough into Azteca, stacking a regular and a Potent Trapped Feint gives you a huge damage boost. You are right saying that getting rid of a shield wastes your Feint as well, but you get some armor piercing capabilities later on, which allow you to weaken the shield but fully use your Feint. Fortunately, Life never has to deal with -80% shields, and encounters -70% dual ones only very late in Azteca, so training Infallible or getting an Incredibly Infallible pet will turn those -50% shields into much less annoying -35%.

      In addition, there are mobs and bosses who never shield from Life, and there are some (Ice) who shield too much to effectively get rid of the shields before striking, and Feint helps you mitigate the fact somehow. The same is mostly true about weakness - some mobs and bosses (starting with Marleybone) use it so often it's easier to just buff more and fight through the Weakness (not the -90% left by Efreet from Zafaria and higher mobs, of course, but the -25% regular and Death Ninja Pig one).

      The fact that it's the whole 7 training points makes it reasonable to postpone training Death until later - but you'll have enough points to eventually get it.
      Last edited by Zarin64; 10-9-13 at 10:35:03 AM. Reason: Overlooked the fact that we are talking about Life
      My wizards: Corwin Swiftcatcher (Death), Alexandra Winterflower (Ice), Darby Firebreeze (Fire), Katie Wildheart (Storm), Heather (Life), Sarah LionHeart (Myth).

    4. #4
      parker89's Avatar
        parker89 is offline Transcendent Wizard
      Status: browsing for new pets.
       
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      i dont believe in secondary schools. i only get what i really need and will use from each school.

    5. #5
      Rayzer's Avatar
        Rayzer is offline Exalted

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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      There really is no "secondary" school in the current meta, although Myth comes the closest, since you have to take it all to get the beneficial spell.
      Thanks to Ashley Frost for the Signature


    6. #6
        jzents is offline Apprentice Wizard

      • jzents's Wizard Stats
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        •  Azteca
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        •  Balance
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        •  Sasha
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      Quote Originally Posted by Zarin64 View Post
      Yes, Feint is the one and only reason to train Death, so not everyone needs it (though Life, Ice and probably Balance do). However, Feint considerably speeds boss fights, and, once you get deep enough into Azteca, stacking a regular and a Potent Trapped Feint gives you a huge damage boost. You are right saying that getting rid of a shield wastes your Feint as well, but you get some armor piercing capabilities later on, which allow you to weaken the shield but fully use your Feint. Fortunately, Life never has to deal with -80% shields, and encounters -70% dual ones only very late in Azteca, so training Infallible or getting an Incredibly Infallible pet will turn those -50% shields into much less annoying -35%.

      In addition, there are mobs and bosses who never shield from Life, and there are some (Ice) who shield too much to effectively get rid of the shields before striking, and Feint helps you mitigate the fact somehow. The same is mostly true about weakness - some mobs and bosses (starting with Marleybone) use it so often it's easier to just buff more and fight through the Weakness (not the -90% left by Efreet from Zafaria and higher mobs, of course, but the -25% regular and Death Ninja Pig one).

      The fact that it's the whole 7 training points makes it reasonable to postpone training Death until later - but you'll have enough points to eventually get it.
      Thank you very much. This helped me a lot since my Life is only in early DS and has trained only Ice to tower at this time. Your points give me much to think on as I make some decisions with my current stash of training points. Thank you for taking the time to give me a long and detailed answer. Cheers!

      - - - Updated - - -

      Quote Originally Posted by LifewiziScarlet View Post
      I only trained to Feint on my life wiz, and it is a HUGE help when you get to Azteca bosses with 15K+ health. And if you want to remove shields, just get some tc pierce from the bazaar.
      Thanks for the reminder of the availability of Pierce TCs. I tend to get mono focused on the bazar's TCs: Tough, Strong, Giant, and Monstrous. Thanks and Cheers!

    7. #7
      LifeMage0909's Avatar
        LifeMage0909 is offline Novice Wizard

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        •  13
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        •  Wizard City
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        •  Life
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        •  Madame Mia
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        •  Seraph
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      I never fully do a secondary school but death and life pair well together.
      Life is a gift, but it is short and judgement follows. Live each day true, and cherish each moment, for as we have been given life, we should all enjoy it.

    8. #8
      Epic Patrick's Avatar
        Epic Patrick is offline Legendary Wizard

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        •  90
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        •  Death
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      Feint and doom and gloom are good. Some people like death masteries for sacrifice, but I'd say 3 pips isn't worth the 500 health and bonus card

    9. #9
      Zarin64's Avatar
        Zarin64 is offline Grandmaster Wizard

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        •  Corwin Swiftcatcher
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        •  100
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        •  Death
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      Quote Originally Posted by Epic Patrick View Post
      Feint and doom and gloom are good. Some people like death masteries for sacrifice, but I'd say 3 pips isn't worth the 500 health and bonus card
      Of the self-damaging Death spells, only Empower and Dark Pact might be worth using as treasure cards. Using Sacrifice by a Life wizard makes no sense whatsoever. In addition to their main effect, those spells help you get rid of universal traps and all kinds of weaknesses, though they are bad if you already have a universal blade on you.
      My wife, who plays Ice, is always carrying Dark Pact with her, especially for fights against Efreet-casting mobs. Notice, though, that neither Empower nor Dark Pact require Death mastery, so I don't see any reason to wear it on a Life wizard. Well, maybe, if you have a pet with Animate item card (Ianthine Spectre, for example) and are really eager to use it .
      My wizards: Corwin Swiftcatcher (Death), Alexandra Winterflower (Ice), Darby Firebreeze (Fire), Katie Wildheart (Storm), Heather (Life), Sarah LionHeart (Myth).

    10. #10
        jzents is offline Apprentice Wizard

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        •  Balance
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        •  Sasha
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        •  Snake in a Basket
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      Re: Why Death as Secondary School?

      Quote Originally Posted by Zarin64 View Post
      Of the self-damaging Death spells, only Empower and Dark Pact might be worth using as treasure cards. Using Sacrifice by a Life wizard makes no sense whatsoever. In addition to their main effect, those spells help you get rid of universal traps and all kinds of weaknesses, though they are bad if you already have a universal blade on you.
      My wife, who plays Ice, is always carrying Dark Pact with her, especially for fights against Efreet-casting mobs. Notice, though, that neither Empower nor Dark Pact require Death mastery, so I don't see any reason to wear it on a Life wizard. Well, maybe, if you have a pet with Animate item card (Ianthine Spectre, for example) and are really eager to use it .
      Interesting. I was not aware that either of those spells stripped weakness etc. off. That is a nice side benefit.

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