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    1. #1
      Swordroll's Avatar
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      Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      Diana Wildheart did a post not too long ago called "PvP Passing: Good or Bad?" She talked about one of her experiences with an opponent that constantly passed.

      PvP's turn-by-turn mechanics definitely don't seem to be perfect, and I'd like to take a little bit of a deeper look into its many flaws. We've heard about puppet teams, constant passing, battles lasting for hours, the fact that going first practically guarantees you a win, etc. Lets sort the myths from the facts. What are you opinions on these matters? Why are they a problem? How can KingsIsle logically solve these PvP problems?

    2. #2
      FireArrow's Avatar
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      How is passing a problem in pvp?
      C:\Users\Gerik\Pictures\fire sig.png
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    3. #3
      {iGnite}'s Avatar
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      Quote Originally Posted by FireArrow View Post
      How is passing a problem in pvp?
      Your really asking what the problem is? Passing is so OP.

      Just kidding. Now to be serious, I think if an opponent is passing it gives you more of an advantage to boost attacks and further orchestrate a quick kill.

      It does give a psychological edge, because the enemy doesn't know what your doing, and it can be even worse if the 'passer' is going first...

      ...BUT it is certainly a losing strategy. It gives the 'passer' the worst of PvP disadvantages and that is to have no defense, and no offense. As long as the other player plays correctly, blades, shielding, and attacking. They should prevail with extreme ease.

      Using the tactic of simply passing reminds me of chess players whom attempt some unorthodox moves to mentally frustrate the opponent in hopes they'll make a mistake. Though more times than not solid play will more than likely defeat any psychological tactic.

      This particular tactic is an attempt to drive at the enemies patience in hopes that they'll blunder, but as with all psychological traps, solid play will always win. The only problem I can see with a person passing is that they've not enough of the right cards to kill you, and you've not enough of the right cards to kill them. With the amount of available resist, spritely, and unicorn pets, a stalemate like this can hypothetically occur given that neither of them can create a high enough damage spike to kill the other.

      The worse thing you can do is mirror their passing strategy, and dissolve to their weak level of play.
      Last edited by {iGnite}; 2-22-12 at 1:09:30 AM.





    4. #4
      alexfirefist's Avatar
        alexfirefist is offline Journeyman Wizard

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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      Quote Originally Posted by Swordroll View Post
      Diana Wildheart did a post not too long ago called "PvP Passing: Good or Bad?" She talked about one of her experiences with an opponent that constantly passed.

      PvP's turn-by-turn mechanics definitely don't seem to be perfect, and I'd like to take a little bit of a deeper look into its many flaws. We've heard about puppet teams, constant passing, battles lasting for hours, the fact that going first practically guarantees you a win, etc. Lets sort the myths from the facts. What are you opinions on these matters? Why are they a problem? How can KingsIsle logically solve these PvP problems?
      ok i got this idea from a game called shadowera. in that game if u go second u got 1 more card and ur hero gets one extra shadow energy. maybe we could sorta transfer that idea to wizard101. maybe if u go 2nd u could get a extra white pip? or possibly one more card or something like that

    5. #5
      Challenge's Avatar
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      Quote Originally Posted by alexfirefist View Post
      ok i got this idea from a game called shadowera. in that game if u go second u got 1 more card and ur hero gets one extra shadow energy. maybe we could sorta transfer that idea to wizard101. maybe if u go 2nd u could get a extra white pip? or possibly one more card or something like that
      You mean by giving them an advantage? I think an advantage could help, but the advantage would have to be something that would last the whole match. A pip at the start of a match won't help someone who gets in hour long matches. The advantage by that time has done little to hinder their opponents progress.
      “To live is the rarest thing in the world. Most people exist, that is all.”
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    6. #6
      Swordroll's Avatar
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      Interesting ideas!

      What Diana wrote about involved her and an opponent who didn't readily have reshuffles, but build up solid defenses, health, and healed. The idea was for Diana to run out of cards before she could make the kill, and that isn't exactly a master strategy. Either way, it didn't end well.

      Besides that, there are a variety of other PvP problems that need to be addressed, and the turn mechanics in general... any other ideas?

    7. #7
      Brad Fire's Avatar
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      I don't see how passing could give you more of an "advantage", especially since you will have no blades, or shields. Going first doesn't give you a guaranteed win, especially if the other person has a better strategy, or get lucky, or something of the sort. I do agree that the turn base system isn't exactly "perfect", but it's not that bad. I do also think that exploits such as "puppet" teams are out of hand, but hopefully they will be fixed. I will post my ideas on fixes later.



    8. #8
        Avalon is offline Fizzled

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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      I think the stereotypical view on "First=Win" is true. It gives many shielding, weakening, dispelling, and healing advantages to who is going first.

      On topic: Passing should only be necessary if there is nothing to work with in your hand, nothing to use. If you have an infection, you should use it, but why use it if your opponents are full healed? You should use it before the opposing player heals, making it more effective.

      I don't think passing plays much of a part in first or second turn having an advantage. Most smart players should know when or when not to use their spells, you never know their strategy.

    9. #9
      Thomas's Avatar
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      I had an idea on how to get rid of this advantage. How about effects don't take place until the next turn. For example say your going first and you cast weakness and your opponent casts leviathan from second. The weakness isn't activated and the opponents leviathan is not weaknessed.

      This causes both players to be playing from second turn. If you attack from first the damage is not dealt untill the other player has gone. So if you use Leprechaun from first and your opponent puts up a tower shield the same turn then the Leprechaun will break the tower shield.

      I've pondered this idea and find a mistake. What about shields? Since your playing on an equal turn basis both players can shield before the other can attack. So both players have to guess if the other will shield, which sounds difficult if you have bad timing. This turns pvp into a bigger mind game then it already is.

      This is just what I've been thinking.
      Last edited by Thomas; 2-23-12 at 3:22:43 AM.
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    10. #10
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      Re: Discussion Thread: Turn By Turn PvP Mechanics

      Any more ideas?

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