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    1. #1
      NicoUzumaki's Avatar
        NicoUzumaki is offline Adept Wizard

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      PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      The arena gives players a chance to test their skills against other players. It was initially suppose to be a place of friendly duels and to encourage sportsmanship in the game. It was a very good idea that KI implemented in the game since we all got bored after reaching grandmaster level and had nothing else to do. The one bad thing about the arena, to date, is that there are no specific rules for the arena.

      The only rules are those that are outlined in the Terms of Use and Privacy Policy; which are legal statements governing the use of Products and Services provided by KingsIsle Entertainment Inc. Such terms and conditions are applicable to Wizard 101 and Wizard 101.com since they are products of KingsIsle Entertainment Inc. However, wizard101.com has a published code of conduct that governs the use of the site. Such conditions may also be applicable to wizard101 game.

      The rules are geared towards behavior that may be illegal or otherwise egregious, such as soliciting personal information, copyright infringements or uploading files that contains a virus (to name a few). But as it relates to questing, duels and trading, there are no established rules to govern such activities. There is even no penalty for being rude or scamming someone out of treasure cards.


      Because it is a card based game and players combat computer generated enemies, they were never any need for rules to spell casting. However, with the advent of PVP it should not have been business as usual, as far as spell casting is concerned.
      The arena certainly need rules. There need to be an established code of conduct for PVP where players who are found to be in breach of such rules are subject to disciplinary actions. The type of sanction would of course depend on the severity of the breach.

      Just imagine football or cricket without any rules. Not to mention basketball. The players would probably kill each other because each player is left to their own conscience and while some may play fair others may not. To keep sports like soccer, cricket and basketball fun and fair, rules are implemented so that players are not left to their own devices.

      I am not sure why KI thought they could get away with allowing players to compete against each other in an arena and not put rules in place for such a venture. They have dropped the ball big time and need to make amends.

      There is no cause or reason to fix any spells. No school is too powerful and no spell is over powered. I say this because the spells were not made for PVP; they are for PVE. So if I'm getting stunned or bolted in the arena; it is not because those spells are bad or too powerful or needs to be fixed. It’s because my opponent is allowed to use them.

      According to Zeke, you cannot report someone for being rude, spamming or for falsely reporting you . Even though such behaviors are questionable, at best, players are responsible for whom they associate with and for the decisions they make with respect to accepting friends, trading, etc.

      I hear rumors going around that earthquake will be “fix”. Earthquake does not need to be fixed. Earthquake removes wards and charms as is displayed on the spell card. All shields, as far as I know are wards, hence the argument that it should not remove stun shields is void. KingsIsle needs to find a better way to prevent chain stunning. A stun aura is trainable at Diego, lean it.

      There is no rule against using a stun spell or using wilt bolt. There is also no rule against using one spell for every round. Fortunately the pip dynamics of the game does not allow you to use certain high level spells in succession but elucidate almost made that possible until somebody saw the light and took it out. However, 0-2 pips spells can be used successively over any number of rounds, namely, stuns, smokescreen, shields, dispels, weakness, and so on.


      Now there is nothing wrong with using any of the spells mentioned above and using them is certainly not cheating. But if you were to use dispel, for instance, for 5 consecutive rounds on your opponent, do you think that is playing fair? It is clearly not cheating because there are no rules that discourages this sort of behavior in PVP but how is the other player suppose to respond to this sort of dueling strategy?

      Let is not forget that this is not an adult only game. We have kids playing too and we try to instill in them a sense of what is right and wrong from the earliest years of their youth. Now if a child should describe the scenario about to his/her parent who does not play the game and asked said parent if it was fair for the opponent to act in such a manner. What answer might that parent give to his/her upset child?

      Kind in mind that the answer will affect the child's sense of right and wrong and what is acceptable behavior. I am saying all this to say that PVP need rules and cannot continue the way it is now.

      There will always be a conflict between PVE and PVP, until KingsIsle find a reasonable solution to the existing problem, instead of those half-hearted attempts at quelling complaints. They need to look at the root cause of the problems that people face in PVP and find ways to solve those problems.

      One solution might be to have different spells for the arena. A simpler solution could be PVP code of conduct. I do not expect them to ban people for everything but there are lighter sanctions they can be levied against unscrupulous persons. Such sanctions could include but not limited to, loosing arena tickets, loosing a rank, being banned from the arena for a period of time, eg a hour or a day, and so on.

      We are looking for permanent solutions to the problems that beset us in PVP and not the simplistic approach that we are currently experiencing. A lot of us have complained but offer solutions; take these under advisement and I’m sure with all the creative minds that KingsIsle has, they can come up with something exceptional.

      There are a lot of intelligent people playing this game, please no not think that we will accept mediocrity. Find a permanent solution to the problems that are ailing PVP so that we can get back to enjoying ALL that wizard101 has to offer (paramount among these is PVP).


      We are sick and tired of being sick and tired of PVP. Do something about it.

      PS. Do not quote all of this in your response. Just reply normally. Thanks
      Scythia / central is story of the week W101C Press(+17000 views)Avi/Sig:Sandy


    2. #2
      HouseofHearts1's Avatar
        HouseofHearts1 is offline Apprentice Wizard

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      Thank you for your input on PVP- impressively put into words!!

    3. #3
      BWildheart's Avatar
        BWildheart is offline Grandmaster Wizard

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      Well said, but unless KI plans on moderating a lot more matches, I fail to see how they are going to program in the ability to sanction a player for being a jerk. People already have a hard enough time wrapping their heads around what is reportable behavior or not in the commons. To implement what you suggested, KI needs boots on the ground, watching matches, and sanctioning people or spectators on the spot.

      Lastly, in any game, card-based or not, people are going to figure out the most optimal combinations of cards to beat the opponent, whether it's a player or a monster. People have been doing that for years in Magic: The Gathering. Unless you plan on simply removing cards from play or limiting the number of a particular type of card you can run (e.g., max 1 Earthquake in the deck), I don't see how anyone much less the game engine, can see a particular string of cards being cast and deem that to be "unsportsmanlike".
      Coffee break is over! Back on your heads!
      My Blog, The Random Pip

    4. #4
        dragoneyone is offline Magus Wizard
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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      I don't see how KI could possibly provide referees for all the duels that occur. I'm sure KI is completely overwhelmed by the number of reports they receive for violations of the regular game rules. Also, the rules on what sort of strategies are allowed and limits on certain cards would get complicated very fast and you know this forum would be full of complaints about how every rule is unfair.

      Anyone using a highly successful strategy, no matter how unsporting it is, should rank up very high, very fast, where they would encounter very skilled players who have their own highly successful strategies and may be able to defend against them. They wouldn't be beating up on your kid, unless they downrank. The real problem is downranking. I'd be happy if they would just rid the arena of the foul mouthed players and the down ranks. These seem like achievable goals to me. As a parent, I don't like my younger child to see what's being said in the arena, nor to be repeatedly beaten up by overpowered/overgeared downranks. Arena is really not a good place for the younger players and that is a shame.

    5. #5
      .Illuminate The World.'s Avatar
        .Illuminate The World. is offline Master Wizard
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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      This would have been a nicely played out idea, but sadly your about a year to late on the uptake.
      The Pvp that we know of today has been around for quite some time now. That being said, if KI planned to do something about it, then they would have done so by now. As for future intentions, specific rules may be applied or may be needed, but most people seriously need to remember the basic concept of this game.
      It's not about pvp, but in rather is about the Pve aspect. The Pve will always come over pvp in W101, and I don't mind that at all. But because of that, KI isn't going to roll over for every idea concerning pvp, Even if it makes sense.

      Besides, if there were certain rules, they would have to be in the optional form, not in the all purposed requirement form. In other words: They would have to be option added to pvp, like when you decided on the type of match: 1v1, 2v2 etc... You could decided to limit the amount of spells allowed to be casted per match, the number of times one spell can be used in a row etc......
      But making them a requirement to All to play pvp would be bad. It may not be bad for you an others, but it wouldn't fix any issues, it would just flip them. Those that hated pvp before would love it, and those that did love it would only end up hating it. Not one person has the right to make pvp into what "They" desire, for it has to be fair to all.. And if there is no specific pvp rules then?........

      Then again, I'm completely neutral on this. I haven't played pvp in over a year, much less I haven't even played the game since Celestia came out. I'm still level 50 on my main character even. I do keep up most of the time with all info though, but recently it's been the other way around. I'm unsure if there has been any pvp updates, but if it's the way I remember, then there are issues, but there will always be, and for KI to have dropped the Ball on this, maybe it would have been better to leave it the way pvp was? You know, the one arena per realm, no extra gear, no rank/ practice etc... I don't know, for I have never ran a full sized game before. Much less, I have never ran anything in which more than 10 people relied on me for something...


      At the end of the day (for me at least) Pvp is still the most flawed aspect of this game, and KI was just going for ratings and popularity when they introduced it. That was very needed to increase the amount of fans and players, but it wasn't needed Imo. They have been successful enough..
      This World is Ugly, Yet Beautiful~ Such Sorrow Brings Joy

    6. #6
      Lady Cat's Avatar
        Lady Cat is offline Prodigious

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      Very well said but sadly not practical As the need for Refs would put too much burden on King Ilse for in game mods. Still It would be nice if it could be done. Lady Cat says Woot!
      <a href=http://www.wizard101central.com/forums/images/signaturepics/sigpic506_7.gif target=_blank>http://www.wizard101central.com/foru...igpic506_7.gif</a>

    7. #7
      stadelmanus's Avatar
        stadelmanus is offline Initiate Wizard

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      Nico – you bring up some valid concerns and have articulated them well. Sometimes PvP can be frustrating but I encourage you concentrate on playing the right cards no matter what the situation.

      Personally I find most of the frustration in playing cards (PvP) comes from a mismatched game; one that has anything from level 1 to 60 in it. The high level player just squashes the low levels with one quick and easy spell. I think people need to be reminded to 1) look for a game that is similar to your level before creating a new one, 2) when creating a new game focus on only allowing players near your level, IMHO a range of plus or minus ten is usually competitive (example - if you are level 26 you can make a game that ranges from 15 to 35). Another reminder for all to make PvP fun; please do not create a game and go away from the keyboard as that is very frustrating and just wastes everyone’s time. Lastly, do not forget to use the ignore button when you need to. I use it often and it really helps.

      One idea for KI – add a sound to the game (bell?) that makes noise when your match comes up in the queue. That way people who MIGHT be afk could hear the bell and know there is a match invitation to respond to.
      Enjoy the journey.

    8. #8
      Mordikay's Avatar
        Mordikay is offline Initiate Wizard

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      Quote Originally Posted by dragoneyone View Post
      I don't see how KI could possibly provide referees for all the duels that occur. I'm sure KI is completely overwhelmed by the number of reports they receive for violations of the regular game rules. Also, the rules on what sort of strategies are allowed and limits on certain cards would get complicated very fast and you know this forum would be full of complaints about how every rule is unfair.

      Anyone using a highly successful strategy, no matter how unsporting it is, should rank up very high, very fast, where they would encounter very skilled players who have their own highly successful strategies and may be able to defend against them. They wouldn't be beating up on your kid, unless they downrank. The real problem is downranking. I'd be happy if they would just rid the arena of the foul mouthed players and the down ranks. These seem like achievable goals to me. As a parent, I don't like my younger child to see what's being said in the arena, nor to be repeatedly beaten up by overpowered/overgeared downranks. Arena is really not a good place for the younger players and that is a shame.
      Not that i encourage it far from and hardly ever speak myself in arena unless it was a particular good match. But you can disable arena chat and it's on as default.

      As for the OP you've pretty much seen my entire view on this on the official boards. I'd just like to state that game mechanics are rules as the run on code. If there were no rules in the game mechanics you'd be able to cast storm lord with 0 pips for example.

      With your ability you will find it impossible to make me fall on even one knee. - Next generation pvp guide.

    9. #9
      Madii's Avatar
        Madii is offline Master Wizard

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      wow....good job you have got a lot of stuff to say bout PvP!!

    10. #10
      NicoUzumaki's Avatar
        NicoUzumaki is offline Adept Wizard

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      Re: PVP: cross, angry, miserable...?

      Thanks for the feedback guys.

      For those who may have a little difficulty grasping everything that I have said in my post, let me give you a brief overview:

      My intention was not to commision KingsIsle Entertainment to implement rules that favors one set of players. Currently the way PVP is structured; it has caused a lot of discomfort amongst those players who duel in the arena to the extent that it has now become a problem for those who don't really care if PVP was taken out of wizard101. To that end, I felt that the responsible thing for KI to do, is to find ways to address the concerns of pvp duelists by taking an indept look at PVP and fixing PVP and not the spells.

      I offered a few suggestions; the onus is on Kingsisle to determine what is feasible and what's not. I am not an authority on game mechancis, therefore, I can only offer solutions, that to the best of my knowledge, will resolve the issues in PVP.

      The bottom line is something HAS to be done about PVP or people will eventually get fed up and walk away.

      We do have other options available to us. Everyday I get email from some MMO game asking me to sigh up but I have decided that wizard101 is the game for me at the moment.

      The situation remains volatile and if KingsIsle continue to be reluctant in addressing PVP issues then who knows what direction the tide will shift in.

      "A word to the wise...."
      Scythia / central is story of the week W101C Press(+17000 views)Avi/Sig:Sandy


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